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From: Avi Kivity <avi@qumranet.com>
To: Andrew Morton <akpm@linux-foundation.org>
Cc: Christoph Lameter <clameter@sgi.com>,
	Andrea Arcangeli <andrea@qumranet.com>, Robin Holt <holt@sgi.com>,
	Izik Eidus <izike@qumranet.com>,
	kvm-devel@lists.sourceforge.net,
	Peter Zijlstra <a.p.zijlstra@chello.nl>,
	general@lists.openfabrics.org,
	Steve Wise <swise@opengridcomputing.com>,
	Roland Dreier <rdreier@cisco.com>,
	Kanoj Sarcar <kanojsarcar@yahoo.com>,
	steiner@sgi.com, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org,
	linux-mm@kvack.org, daniel.blueman@quadrics.com
Subject: Re: [patch 1/6] mmu_notifier: Core code
Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2008 11:21:24 +0200	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <47B6AB14.5090408@qumranet.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20080216005653.353a62dc.akpm@linux-foundation.org>

Andrew Morton wrote:

  

>> Very.  kvm pins pages that are referenced by the guest;
>>     
>
> hm.  Why does it do that?
>
>   

It was deemed best not to allow the guest to write to a page that has 
been swapped out and assigned to an unrelated host process.

One way to view the kvm shadow page tables is as hardware dma 
descriptors. kvm pins pages for the same reason that drivers pin pages 
that are being dma'ed. It's also the reason why mmu notifiers are useful 
for such a wide range of dma capable hardware.

>> a 64-bit guest 
>> will easily pin its entire memory with the kernel map.
>>     
>
>   
>>  So this is 
>> critical for guest swapping to actually work.
>>     
>
> Curious.  If KVM can release guest pages at the request of this notifier so
> that they can be swapped out, why can't it release them by default, and
> allow swapping to proceed?
>
>   

If kvm releases a page, it must also zap any shadow ptes pointing at the 
page and flush the tlb. If you do that for all of memory you can't 
reference any of it.

Releasing a page has costs, both at the time of the release and when the 
guest eventually refers to the page again.

>> Other nice features like page migration are also enabled by this patch.
>>
>>     
>
> We already have page migration.  Do you mean page-migration-when-using-kvm?
>   

Yes, I'm obviously writing from a kvm-centric point of view. This is an 
important feature, as the virtualization future seems to be NUMA hosts 
(2- or 4- way, 4 cores per socket) running moderately sized guests. The 
ability to load-balance guests among the NUMA nodes is important for 
performance.

(btw, I'm also looking forward to memory defragmentation. large pages 
are important for virtualization workloads and mmu notifiers are again 
critical to getting it to work while running kvm).

-- 
Any sufficiently difficult bug is indistinguishable from a feature.


  reply	other threads:[~2008-02-16  9:22 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 116+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2008-02-15  6:48 [patch 0/6] MMU Notifiers V7 Christoph Lameter
2008-02-15  6:49 ` [patch 1/6] mmu_notifier: Core code Christoph Lameter
2008-02-16  3:37   ` Andrew Morton
2008-02-16  8:45     ` Avi Kivity
2008-02-16  8:56       ` Andrew Morton
2008-02-16  9:21         ` Avi Kivity [this message]
2008-02-16 10:41     ` Brice Goglin
2008-02-16 10:58       ` Andrew Morton
2008-02-16 19:31         ` Christoph Lameter
2008-02-16 19:21     ` Christoph Lameter
2008-02-17  3:01       ` Andrea Arcangeli
2008-02-17 12:24         ` Robin Holt
2008-02-17  5:04     ` Doug Maxey
2008-02-18 22:33   ` Roland Dreier
2008-02-15  6:49 ` [patch 2/6] mmu_notifier: Callbacks to invalidate address ranges Christoph Lameter
2008-02-16  3:37   ` Andrew Morton
2008-02-16 19:26     ` Christoph Lameter
2008-02-19  8:54   ` Nick Piggin
2008-02-19 13:34     ` Andrea Arcangeli
2008-02-27 22:23       ` Christoph Lameter
2008-02-27 23:57         ` Andrea Arcangeli
2008-02-19 23:08   ` Nick Piggin
2008-02-20  1:00     ` Andrea Arcangeli
2008-02-20  3:00       ` Robin Holt
2008-02-20  3:11         ` Nick Piggin
2008-02-20  3:19           ` Robin Holt
2008-02-27 22:39       ` Christoph Lameter
2008-02-28  0:38         ` Andrea Arcangeli
2008-02-27 22:35     ` Christoph Lameter
2008-02-27 22:42       ` Jack Steiner
2008-02-28  0:10       ` Christoph Lameter
2008-02-28  0:11       ` Andrea Arcangeli
2008-02-28  0:14         ` Christoph Lameter
2008-02-28  0:52           ` Andrea Arcangeli
2008-02-28  1:03             ` Christoph Lameter
2008-02-28  1:10               ` Andrea Arcangeli
2008-02-28 18:43                 ` Christoph Lameter
2008-02-29  0:55                   ` Andrea Arcangeli
2008-02-29  0:59                     ` Christoph Lameter
2008-02-29 13:13                       ` Andrea Arcangeli
2008-02-29 19:55                         ` Christoph Lameter
2008-02-29 20:17                           ` Andrea Arcangeli
2008-02-29 21:03                             ` Christoph Lameter
2008-02-29 21:23                               ` Andrea Arcangeli
2008-02-29 21:29                                 ` Christoph Lameter
2008-02-29 21:34                                 ` Christoph Lameter
2008-02-29 21:48                                   ` Andrea Arcangeli
2008-02-29 22:12                                     ` Christoph Lameter
2008-02-29 22:41                                       ` Andrea Arcangeli
2008-02-28 10:53             ` Robin Holt
2008-03-03  5:11       ` Nick Piggin
2008-03-03 19:28         ` Christoph Lameter
2008-03-03 19:50           ` Nick Piggin
2008-03-04 18:58             ` Christoph Lameter
2008-03-05  0:52               ` Nick Piggin
2008-02-15  6:49 ` [patch 3/6] mmu_notifier: invalidate_page callbacks Christoph Lameter
2008-02-16  3:37   ` Andrew Morton
2008-02-16 11:07     ` Andrea Arcangeli
2008-02-16 19:22     ` Christoph Lameter
2008-02-16 19:54       ` Avi Kivity
2008-02-19  8:46       ` Nick Piggin
2008-02-19 13:30         ` Andrea Arcangeli
2008-02-18  1:51     ` Nick Piggin
2008-02-15  6:49 ` [patch 4/6] mmu_notifier: Skeleton driver for a simple mmu_notifier Christoph Lameter
2008-02-15  6:49 ` [patch 5/6] mmu_notifier: Support for drivers with revers maps (f.e. for XPmem) Christoph Lameter
2008-02-16  3:37   ` Andrew Morton
2008-02-16 19:28     ` Christoph Lameter
2008-02-19 23:55   ` Nick Piggin
2008-02-20  3:12     ` Robin Holt
2008-02-20  3:51       ` Nick Piggin
2008-02-20  9:00         ` Robin Holt
2008-02-20  9:05           ` Robin Holt
2008-02-21  4:20           ` Nick Piggin
2008-02-21 10:58             ` Robin Holt
2008-02-26  6:11               ` Nick Piggin
2008-02-26  7:21                 ` [ofa-general] " Gleb Natapov
2008-02-26  8:52                   ` Nick Piggin
2008-02-26  9:38                     ` Gleb Natapov
2008-02-26  9:52                       ` KOSAKI Motohiro
2008-02-26 12:28                     ` Robin Holt
2008-02-26 12:29                 ` Robin Holt
2008-02-27 22:43     ` Christoph Lameter
2008-02-28  0:42       ` Andrea Arcangeli
2008-02-28  1:01         ` Christoph Lameter
2008-02-15  6:49 ` [patch 6/6] mmu_rmap_notifier: Skeleton for complex driver that uses its own rmaps Christoph Lameter
2008-02-16 10:48 ` [PATCH] KVM swapping with MMU Notifiers V7 Andrea Arcangeli
2008-02-16 11:08   ` Andrew Morton
2008-02-18 12:17     ` Andrea Arcangeli
2008-02-16 11:51   ` Robin Holt
2008-02-18 12:35     ` Andrea Arcangeli
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2008-02-08 22:06 [patch 0/6] MMU Notifiers V6 Christoph Lameter
2008-02-08 22:06 ` [patch 1/6] mmu_notifier: Core code Christoph Lameter
2008-01-30  2:29 [patch 0/6] [RFC] MMU Notifiers V3 Christoph Lameter
2008-01-30  2:29 ` [patch 1/6] mmu_notifier: Core code Christoph Lameter
2008-01-30 15:37   ` Andrea Arcangeli
2008-01-30 15:53     ` Jack Steiner
2008-01-30 16:38       ` Andrea Arcangeli
2008-01-30 19:19       ` Christoph Lameter
2008-01-30 22:20         ` Robin Holt
2008-01-30 23:38           ` Andrea Arcangeli
2008-01-30 23:55             ` Christoph Lameter
2008-01-30 17:10     ` Peter Zijlstra
2008-01-30 19:28       ` Christoph Lameter
2008-01-30 18:02   ` Robin Holt
2008-01-30 19:08     ` Christoph Lameter
2008-01-30 19:14     ` Christoph Lameter
2008-01-28 20:28 [patch 0/6] [RFC] MMU Notifiers V2 Christoph Lameter
2008-01-28 20:28 ` [patch 1/6] mmu_notifier: Core code Christoph Lameter
2008-01-28 22:06   ` Christoph Lameter
2008-01-29  0:05   ` Robin Holt
2008-01-29  1:19     ` Christoph Lameter
2008-01-29 13:59   ` Andrea Arcangeli
2008-01-29 14:34     ` Andrea Arcangeli
2008-01-29 19:49     ` Christoph Lameter
2008-01-29 20:41       ` Avi Kivity
2008-01-29 16:07   ` Robin Holt
2008-02-05 18:05   ` Andy Whitcroft
2008-02-05 18:17     ` Peter Zijlstra
2008-02-05 18:19     ` Christoph Lameter

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