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From: Casey Schaufler <casey@schaufler-ca.com>
To: Tilman Baumann <tilman.baumann@collax.com>
Cc: Linux-Kernel <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
	linux-security-module@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: SMACK netfilter smacklabel socket match
Date: Mon, 06 Oct 2008 19:42:25 -0700	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <48EACC91.8040008@schaufler-ca.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <48EA0B30.6080907@collax.com>

Tilman Baumann wrote:
> Casey Schaufler wrote:
>> Tilman Baumann wrote:
>>> Casey Schaufler wrote:
>>> If I set /smack/nltype to 'unlabeled' I have effectively shut off 
>>> the network.
>>> I guess I'm missing some essential point here.
>>> Sorry to bother you with such trivialities.
>>
>> Not to worry. The essential point is that with MAC you can't just lock
>> the doors, you have to lock the windows as well. What I mean by that is
>> that traditional access controls apply to files, but not network
>> communications. Network communications became popular in part because
>> they were allowed to leave any restrictions up to the applications
>> and their protocols. MAC requirements are pickier than that. The good
>> news is that with a scheme like CIPSO you can easily enforce the
>> policy. The bad news is that network services in general assume that
>> there is no policy being enforced on them.
>
> This might work well in trusted networks.
> But Internet is untrusted and needs to work too. At least in the most 
> real world scenarios. :)

Yes. I'm pretty close to convinced that it needs to be included as
part of the single-label host solution. Not that it can possibly be
excused in any real secure environment mind you.

>>> If i set /smack/nltype to 'unlabled' i don't even get SYN packets 
>>> out. (operation not permitted)
>>
>> That's probably a bug, but I think the "fix" is to disable the 
>> ability to
>> set the nltype to anything other than CIPSO at least for the time being.
>
> Well, there is a case statement in smack_lsm.c that checks for the 
> nltype (smack_net_nltype) and omits net labeling if cipso is not set.
> This seems to be a very sensible thing to do. I strongly advice for a 
> way to omit netlabel based access control.

Yes, I hear you.

> As soon as you leave controlled and trusted networks, netlabels seem 
> in my eyes like a maybe even critical information leak.
>
> btw. I tried return 0; in smk_access(), but it did not make networking 
> work again with nltype set to unlabled. So I guess the problem is not 
> some access check.
>
> If you have any idea how i can avoid any cipso labels on the network 
> but use smack for local access control?
> I don't try to secure information channels. Our system is a general 
> purpose server, it would defeat the purpose of our system to lock it 
> up since our clients are never going to use cipso.
>
> I'm pretty sure the cipso labels are the problem. Since I can easily 
> access resources in the local network. But things break when I access 
> over Internet.
> And I can not even expect this to work in any network where the system 
> will be deployed.
>


  parent reply	other threads:[~2008-10-07  2:42 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 30+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2008-09-25 17:25 Tilman Baumann
2008-09-25 18:26 ` Paul Moore
2008-09-25 19:26   ` Tilman Baumann
2008-09-25 19:57     ` Paul Moore
2008-09-25 20:32       ` Tilman Baumann
2008-09-26 12:35   ` Tilman Baumann
2008-09-26 19:55     ` Paul Moore
2008-09-26  3:43 ` Casey Schaufler
2008-09-26  8:19   ` Tilman Baumann
2008-09-27  5:01     ` Casey Schaufler
2008-09-29 16:21       ` Tilman Baumann
2008-09-30  3:29         ` Casey Schaufler
2008-10-01 11:29           ` Tilman Baumann
2008-10-01 15:21             ` Casey Schaufler
2008-10-01 16:55               ` Tilman Baumann
2008-10-01 18:22                 ` Casey Schaufler
2008-10-06 12:57                   ` Tilman Baumann
2008-10-06 23:05                     ` Ahmed S. Darwish
2008-10-07  2:42                     ` Casey Schaufler [this message]
2008-10-17 16:57                       ` Tilman Baumann
2008-10-17 17:53                         ` Casey Schaufler
2008-10-20 12:06                           ` Tilman Baumann
2008-10-20 15:01                             ` Casey Schaufler
2008-10-22  3:36                             ` Casey Schaufler
2008-10-30 16:06                               ` Tilman Baumann
2008-10-31  3:46                                 ` Casey Schaufler
2008-12-11  0:03                                 ` Casey Schaufler
2008-12-11 10:18                                   ` Tilman Baumann
2008-12-11 16:29                                     ` Casey Schaufler
2008-10-23 11:55                           ` Paul Moore

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